Desh | 0 Posted January 24, 2023 Share Posted January 24, 2023 I seem to have an odd issue with a recently acquired NES top loader. I installed Tim's RGB mod (version 3.0 with no palette selection), tossed in one of Voultar's nice expansion audio boards and modded my old Everdrive N8 to output expansion audio from pin 51. Everything works as expected but I kept getting disk errors when attempting to load FDS games. I suspected maybe there was an issue with the latest N8 firmware (1.26). I did try every version of the N8 firmware back to 1.15 and no change (other than the older versions had the original FDS load screen). I then brought out my Hi-Def NES modded front loader and have absolutely no issues loading FDS games with any of the firmwares. It is obviously an issue with my top loader setup but what? I have spent hours trying to internet search for anyone who may have had a similar issue to no avail. Unfortunately, I do not have any other top loaders to test on currently and I have to assume there probably aren't too many out there with the "covid version" of the RGB mod installed. Has anyone else ever run into any sort of issues loading FDS games on a top loader? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanooki | 5,115 Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 Well it seems pretty safe to say it's the toploader, but now it would be to figure out what. You eliminate the N8 because of the kit in your classic system (have the same in a top loader for me and it works great.) Is there a chance you fouled up your audio board mod or perhaps the RGB one? It seems the original system works, but the thing is, it's modded too. Any shot you have access to a stock non-top loader nintendo to try? I've used FDS games just fine on my system, so it's not some bug with the cart I would think, or the combination of the cart with a top loader, though as I said, mine is modded. Your normal NES+hdmi kit combo works fine, and my toploader+same kit works fine, so that does eliminate the compatibility issue in that way at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desh | 0 Posted January 25, 2023 Author Share Posted January 25, 2023 Thanks for the reply. It's the weirdest thing. Everything else works flawlessly including the expansion audio. I went over everything to verify something wasn't accidentally bridged etc. I have a buddy that happens to have a stock toploader so I can 100% verify it isn't some strange combination of my N8 (which is a pretty early revision) and a toploader. The only change made to the N8 was to bridge pin 54 to pin 51 since Voultar's resistor board pulls expansion audio from pin 51 on the toploader version. I think I may just remove the resistor board and bridge in the N8 to take that out of the equation for now. I have also verified FDS games work just fine on a stock front loader as well (sans expansion audio of course). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMR | 538 Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 I've got a modded toploader and N8 laying around. I'll give mine a try tomorrow. I'm not sure if I ever played any FDS games on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanooki | 5,115 Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 Seems it's something you added/changed to the hardware here causing this, at least that's how I feel at this rate. Due cut one thing at a time and test, see when/if it recovers, something is at play here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMR | 538 Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 Sorry, I didn't get to try it out. Maybe tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMR | 538 Posted January 28, 2023 Share Posted January 28, 2023 I tried mine and it works perfectly. I've got expansion audio and everything. I don't really have a clue what could be wrong with yours. Here's a pic of my N8 cart and how I modded it. I don't know if my pins match yours or not, I didn't count them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanooki | 5,115 Posted January 28, 2023 Share Posted January 28, 2023 This is kind of a side thing maybe, but can you explain to me why this 2 pin mod there in the image above is necessary? And is it needed if you're running a HiDefNES kit (or AVS, Noir) which is already setup to handle the expanded audio? Or just needed for stock hardware? From what I've seen as I have that kit in my top loader, the audio just works. I have to go into the menu, select to use VRC6 etc audio with the checkboxes, and it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkchylde28 | 1,546 Posted January 28, 2023 Share Posted January 28, 2023 Are the mod and/or the chips that got relocated for the mod soldered into the board, or socketed? I know the more professional modders typically socket everything so as to be able to reverse the mod (for the most part) if desired, so if it's socketed, why not try removing the mod, then replacing the relocated chip(s) and seeing if the results are different? That way you'll be able to tell whether it's something off with the mod itself or one of the chips that got moved got partially cooked and damaged during removal and relocation to the mod board. If it's all soldered in, it might be time to start inspecting the solder sites for bridged pins/traces/etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMR | 538 Posted January 29, 2023 Share Posted January 29, 2023 (edited) 11 hours ago, Tanooki said: This is kind of a side thing maybe, but can you explain to me why this 2 pin mod there in the image above is necessary? And is it needed if you're running a HiDefNES kit (or AVS, Noir) which is already setup to handle the expanded audio? Or just needed for stock hardware? From what I've seen as I have that kit in my top loader, the audio just works. I have to go into the menu, select to use VRC6 etc audio with the checkboxes, and it works. For the HiDef NES mod Kevtris emulated the VRC6 and other expansion audio chips on the HiDef fpga. For a standard top loader, the expansion audio pins are missing from the cart slot completely. This mod shifts audio output from it's normal pin to another pin that does have a connector pin in the cart slot. I can't remember what this pin was originally for, but it's essentially unused for the most part. That cart slot pin is then connected to a point on the RGB mod board that mixes the audio back in with the consoles audio out. There is also a resistor and a wire that needs to be connected like in the front loader, and that's what Voultar's board is supposed to do. I think newer N8 Pros have this mod built in. You also have to do the two pin mod above on 72pin to 60pin adapters if you want expansion audio from famicom games. Edited January 29, 2023 by CMR 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanooki | 5,115 Posted January 29, 2023 Share Posted January 29, 2023 19 hours ago, CMR said: For the HiDef NES mod Kevtris emulated the VRC6 and other expansion audio chips on the HiDef fpga. For a standard top loader, the expansion audio pins are missing from the cart slot completely. This mod shifts audio output from it's normal pin to another pin that does have a connector pin in the cart slot. I can't remember what this pin was originally for, but it's essentially unused for the most part. That cart slot pin is then connected to a point on the RGB mod board that mixes the audio back in with the consoles audio out. There is also a resistor and a wire that needs to be connected like in the front loader, and that's what Voultar's board is supposed to do. I think newer N8 Pros have this mod built in. You also have to do the two pin mod above on 72pin to 60pin adapters if you want expansion audio from famicom games. So it's a mod for a mod, a workaround to get the audio going while the route I went, the kit has it covered. The only annoyance is, you need to enable the audio each time, really no idea why it doesn't remember it. It's not a big deal, takes a moment is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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