General Current Events/Political Discussion

[fcgamer | 5,015]

2 minutes ago, NESfiend said:

As far as China being responsible, it matters very little how it got here. Maybe they did send it on purpose, though there is 0 evidence of that. If we get attacked and fail to respond, are you going to give him a pass because he didn't know whatever county may attack us? Hell no. How you respond matters. He called it a hoax, told us it would go away with weather, no one would die. Then told the states to procur their own equipment and allowed them all to bid against one another. Thats not a federal response to a major problem. It was a failure from any objective standpoint 

Lol lol lol. When the experts (the world health organisation) is playing down the seriousness of the situation (they were, check some facts), how is a non expert (Trump) supposed to know the seriousness of the matter, especially when it was something as unprecedented as this pandemic? 

Clean your glasses, look at the facts. It's the same reason things were handled poorly in Italy, and basically every country across the globe. The only country that weathered the storm quite well, the one in which aside from an extra two weeks holidays for the winter break kept school opened during the pandemic (one of maybe three countries in the entire world, three...to do so!!!) is Taiwan. But they aren't allowed in the WHO due to China's politics. Isn't that interesting though, the only country that handled things well wasn't getting fed wrong information from an organisation that is supposed to be made up of experts.

But yeah, let's blame the virus on Trump, fail to look at the realities. Oh the evil Trump!

[Estil | 1,292]

6 minutes ago, The Strangest said:

And we need an honest to God communist to run in this country so our citizens can see what it’s really like. It’s pretty sobering that the United States is such a right leaning/conservative country that we think a guy puddling a diet versions of ideas that work in every other successful country in the world is full blown communism.

As crazy as this sounds, and I've said this before, Bernie could've easily won in 2016 because unlike Hillary, neither he nor his spouse had any of the questionable moral baggage (for lack of better term), could actually draw good/hungry crowds and also had a similar populist flavor, albeit on the polar opposite of the political spectrum.  Trump simply wouldn't have had nearly as much ammo against Bernie like he did against Hillary.  Let's just say Sanders didn't have any bleached emails, a flagrantly perverted spouse and there wasn't really anything Trump could chant "lock him up!" at him over.

Edited June 5, 2020 by Estil

[MrWunderful | 2,932]

2 minutes ago, fcgamer said:

Lol lol lol. When the experts (the world health organisation) is playing down the seriousness of the situation (they were, check some facts), how is a non expert (Trump) supposed to know the seriousness of the matter, especially when it was something as unprecedented as this pandemic? 

Clean your glasses, look at the facts. It's the same reason things were handled poorly in Italy, and basically every country across the globe. The only country that weathered the storm quite well, the one in which aside from an extra two weeks holidays for the winter break kept school opened during the pandemic (one of maybe three countries in the entire world, three...to do so!!!) is Taiwan. But they aren't allowed in the WHO due to China's politics. Isn't that interesting though, the only country that handled things well wasn't getting fed wrong information from an organisation that is supposed to be made up of experts.

But yeah, let's blame the virus on Trump, fail to look at the realities. Oh the evil Trump!

He should be listening to the fucking experts who were telling him its a problem. Obama left him a goddamn playbook. 
 

The Problem isnt that Trump ISNT an expert, its just he THINKS HE IS

[Reed Rothchild | 9,932]

@fcgamer

On an A to F scale, why don't you grade the US administration's response to COVID.

And then I want you to grab any single non-American member of VGS, and have them share their thoughts on your grade.

 

[fcgamer | 5,015]

3 minutes ago, MrWunderful said:

He should be listening to the fucking experts who were telling him its a problem. Obama left him a goddamn playbook. 
 

The Problem isnt that Trump ISNT an expert, its just he THINKS HE IS

Experts are only as good as the information being provided to you, and the information provided by the who was, in many cases, false. This all could have been prevented if the right information would have been out out there initially (it was prevented in Taiwan, an island nation quite near to the epicenter of the virus, an island that has a lot of relations with China, for better or worse). But it wasn't, because of the who kowtowing to China. Period. 

Look at every other country bin the world, they are also covered in the same shit. 

[Estil | 1,292]

Just now, Reed Rothchild said:

@fcgamer

On an A to F scale, why don't you grade the US administration's response to COVID.

And then I want you to grab any single non-American member of VGS, and have them share their thoughts on your grade.

To put it bluntly, it's just too early to tell.  I mean I hope and pray we get through this whole virus thing but frankly we just don't know for sure how it will play out.  I will say those idiot rioters throwing their violent temper tantrums are not doing themselves any favors regarding the whole social distancing thing.  No really, when has rioting ever been a good thing?

[Gloves | 12,266]

4 minutes ago, Reed Rothchild said:

@fcgamer

On an A to F scale, why don't you grade the US administration's response to COVID.

And then I want you to grab any single non-American member of VGS, and have them share their thoughts on your grade.

 

[ThePhleo | 2,270]

I know it wasn’t addressed to me, but I say “C-“ just barely above passing grade.

They did a little for people with the stimulus and unemployment for people who don’t even have unemployment insurance, but they did a disproportionate amount for business owners like myself, and even way more for medium to large corporations.

...

The American people though? A+ until last week, now F. No masks while protesting? Tsk tsk tsk...it could have even been symbolic as “i can’t breathe”

We really pulled together and got through the hardest part without tearing each other apart. But we sorta lost our way on the second half.

[Reed Rothchild | 9,932]

2 minutes ago, Estil said:

To put it bluntly, it's just too early to tell.  I mean I hope and pray we get through this whole virus thing but frankly we just don't know for sure how it will play out.  I will say those idiot rioters throwing their violent temper tantrums are not doing themselves any favors regarding the whole social distancing thing.  No really, when has rioting ever been a good thing?

See what you did there?  You deflected to the rioters.  Not even the protesters, but the rioters. A very Trumpian move.  Avoid accountabilities by pointing a finger somewhere.

 

[Strange | 1,730]

15 minutes ago, Estil said:

As crazy as this sounds, and I've said this before, Bernie could've easily won in 2016 because unlike Hillary, neither he nor his spouse had any of the questionable moral baggage (for lack of better term), could actually draw good/hungry crowds and also had a similar populist flavor, albeit on the polar opposite of the political spectrum.  Trump simply wouldn't have had nearly as much ammo against Bernie like he did against Hillary.  Let's just say Sanders didn't have any bleached emails, a flagrantly perverted spouse and there wasn't really anything Trump could chant "lock him up!" at him over.

I don’t disagree with you here. I think Bernie would have had a solid chance against Trump. Hillary, again, was such an awful candidate. Most liberals in the United States were saying “anyone but her” through the primaries.

I was in Germany visiting my family the summer before the election. Every German I spoke to asked “How did you guys manage to choose the two worst candidates in your entire country?”

[Estil | 1,292]

3 minutes ago, Reed Rothchild said:

See what you did there?  You deflected to the rioters.  Not even the protesters, but the rioters. A very Trumpian move.  Avoid accountabilities by pointing a finger somewhere.

Because I have no issue with the protesters.  They're not the ones going around burning and breaking stuff and hurting people.

[Gloves | 12,266]

Just now, Estil said:

Because I have no issue with the protesters.  They're not the ones going around burning and breaking stuff and hurting people.

The police are doing a fine enough job of that.

[Estil | 1,292]

1 minute ago, The Strangest said:

I don’t disagree with you here. I think Bernie would have had a solid chance against Trump. Hillary, again, was such an awful candidate. Most liberals in the United States were saying “anyone but her” through the primaries.

Given how for many decades were were excited about what the first female President might be like and what a great historical moment it would be...I hoped and prayed we would not have wasted our one and only first female President who would've sent two messages loud and clear with her victory...crime DOES pay and cheaters DO win!  And don't even get me started about how the first "First Gentleman" would most definitely NOT live up to that title.

Of course, as our state lottery once said, someone had to win, might as well have been the casino guy!

[fcgamer | 5,015]

5 minutes ago, Reed Rothchild said:

@fcgamer

On an A to F scale, why don't you grade the US administration's response to COVID.

And then I want you to grab any single non-American member of VGS, and have them share their thoughts on your grade.

 

Not going to give a grade, it's almost 4am here and I'm about ready to cash out for the night. To give a fair grade, I'd have to research stats, how other countries handled the situation, death tolls compared to methods used, etc.

On a quick note though, based solely on people I know from these areas, with whom I've talked:

South Africa enforced a very strict lockdown, from my understanding, it makes the US one look like summer camp. How is their situation?

A Polish friend living in Norway feels that Norway did a terrible job at taking the situation seriously, and that even Poland implemented better measures than Norway. So much I could say on this issue.

Sweden iirc tried for herd immunity, how did that work out?

In England and the UK, nobody took things seriously, and everyone just went to the pub or the beach when they were given time off from work. How's things in their country?

What about Italy?

Or let's even look at China themselves. Wielding doors shut to apartments, putting people into prison hospitals to die, the list goes on and on.

Then we also need to take into account all the cases where people had covid-19, but died likely from other causes, yet were listed as a covid-19 death. This has happened a lot, anyone that believes otherwise must be quite nieve on the matter.

So yeah, I don't think the USA faired particularly worse than anywhere else, and with that said, no where (aside from Taiwan) faired particularly well, but then again everyone was playing with only half a deck, once again thanks to the WHO turning a pandemic into a political situation.

 

[MrWunderful | 2,932]

Remember when the President was calling it the “New Democratic Hoax”

 

Remember when He didnt want American citizens (that he represents-even if they are God awful bleeding heart liberal Californians) Getting off a cruise ship because the media was going to report on the numbers?

 

He discounted it multiple times while playing golf. That has nothing to do with WHO (even though they shit the bed too)
 

But like, who cares about that because Biden made a Bad joke on a podcast that he immediately apologized for. 

[fcgamer | 5,015]

11 minutes ago, Reed Rothchild said:

See what you did there?  You deflected to the rioters.  Not even the protesters, but the rioters. A very Trumpian move.  Avoid accountabilities by pointing a finger somewhere.

 

That's right. And you and crew are deflecting blame off of Tedros, the who, and their lies by pointing the finger at Trump.

[fcgamer | 5,015]

12 minutes ago, ChickenTendas4PokeyEater said:

Exactly. He went out of his way to downplay the virus, dodging the blame, losing precious time before the number of cases and deaths skyrocketed. Sure, you can't blame everything on him (the US' citizens are way worse at following government orders than the majority of other countries), but he literally could not have handled this situation worse. In Boy Scouts we learned that great leaders take all the blame and none of the compliments. Trump is the exact opposite of that. My generation will most likely use Trump as a "what not to do" guide.

The precious time was lost weeks earlier dude!!! The seriousness was downplayed weeks earlier too!!! Follow the virus from start to now and anyone can see that! It's not Trump, it's the WHO, it's Tedros, it's China.

Interestingly enough how other nations actually can see this, like Australia for example.

[MrWunderful | 2,932]

1 minute ago, fcgamer said:

That's right. And you and crew are deflecting blame off of Tedros, the who, and their lies by pointing the finger at Trump.

Trump shit the bed in multiple ways. Ignoring that because you want to blame the WHO is stupid. 
 

Blame WHO, who cares? 
 

 

Heres a Timeline of Trumps Fuckups :

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/rolling-stone-timeline-coronavirus-america-982944/amp/

Dont believe that?

Google “trump coronavirus failures”

 

But then again, none of us echo chamber folks provide backups to our arguments

[fcgamer | 5,015]

5 minutes ago, MrWunderful said:

Remember when the President was calling it the “New Democratic Hoax”

 

Remember when He didnt want American citizens (that he represents-even if they are God awful bleeding heart liberal Californians) Getting off a cruise ship because the media was going to report on the numbers?

 

He discounted it multiple times while playing golf. That has nothing to do with WHO (even though they shit the bed too)
 

But like, who cares about that because Biden made a Bad joke on a podcast that he immediately apologized for. 

Yeah I remember the cruise ship around these waters that wasn't allowed to dock, due to safety concerns of infecting others. Makes sense to me, eventually the ship in my area sorted things out .

If we want to discuss media and numbers, maybe the real issue is that you guys don't tally numbers in a proper fashion. Here, the cases are being tracked by local infections, imported infections, and then infections stemming from a ship abroad.

[Tulpa | 3,715]

12 minutes ago, Estil said:

Given how for many decades were were excited about what the first female President might be like and what a great historical moment it would be...I hoped and prayed we would not have wasted our one and only first female President who would've sent two messages loud and clear with her victory...crime DOES pay and cheaters DO win! 

Instead we got an old white guy for whom crime pays and cheaters win. And if the Senate decides to turn a blind eye to coercing Ukraine for political gain, they keep on winning, apparently.

[Estil | 1,292]

5 minutes ago, MrWunderful said:

Heres a Timeline of Trumps Fuckups :

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/rolling-stone-timeline-coronavirus-america-982944/amp/

Dont believe that?

Google “trump coronavirus failures”

But then again, none of us echo chamber folks provide backups to our arguments

This coming from someone who throws around "fox news bs" even when nothing said came from Fox News...your last two sources, Rolling Stone (the one who infamously put Obama on the cover and made him look like Jesus) and Newsweek (or Obamaweek as I liked to call it back then) are about about the most super liberal/anti-Trump sources possible.  What's your next "back up to your argument", Vox, Mother Jones?  

Rules for thee but not for me, right?

Edited June 5, 2020 by Estil

[fcgamer | 5,015]

2 minutes ago, MrWunderful said:

Trump shit the bed in multiple ways. Ignoring that because you want to blame the WHO is stupid. 
 

Blame WHO, who cares? 
 

 

Heres a Timeline of Trumps Fuckups :

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/rolling-stone-timeline-coronavirus-america-982944/amp/

Dont believe that?

Google “trump coronavirus failures”

 

But then again, none of us echo chamber folks provide backups to our arguments

Okay, now do yourself a favour and compare Trump's "fails" to the actions of other countries around the globe. If Trump and the USA were in shit, but every other country was doing well, then yes, I could blame things on him. But seeing as basically EVERY COUNTRY faired poorly, aside from Taiwan (the only country not listening to the WHO and their pack of lies), speaks loudly about the situation at hand. Just step back from the politics, and look at the facts.

[Gloves | 12,266]

4 minutes ago, fcgamer said:

Okay, now do yourself a favour and compare Trump's "fails" to the actions of other countries around the globe. If Trump and the USA were in shit, but every other country was doing well, then yes, I could blame things on him. But seeing as basically EVERY COUNTRY faired poorly, aside from Taiwan (the only country not listening to the WHO and their pack of lies), speaks loudly about the situation at hand. Just step back from the politics, and look at the facts.

Canada is doing comparatively well, and we're arguably the most apt country for comparison.

I do notice that every post you make about other countries you fail to bring up the USA's neighbor.

[fcgamer | 5,015]

Just now, Gloves said:

Canada is doing comparatively well, and we're arguably the most apt country for comparison.

I do notice that every post you make about other countries you fail to bring up your neighbor.

Comparatively well...well how are we setting the standards of comparison?

Canada definitely isn't on the short list of countries that will be reviving international travel in the near future that I've heard (iirc that list consists of Japan, South Korea, New Zealand, and possibly Vietnam and Australia, yeah Taiwan should be on that list but isn't due to their unfortunate international status around the globe), so I guess they aren't doing all too well. Actually, that reminds me, at the moment I can't even send post to Canada. 

 

[Reed Rothchild | 9,932]

25 minutes ago, Estil said:

Because I have no issue with the protesters.  They're not the ones going around burning and breaking stuff and hurting people.

So you couldn't answer the question, so you deflected.  Right?  Are we in agreement here?  Think about that.