Bearcat-Doug | 5,123 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 11 minutes ago, Tulpa said: https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/6-trump-campaign-members-tulsa-test-positive-coronavirus-ahead-rally-n1231647 6 Trump campaign members in Tulsa test positive for the coronavirus ahead of rally They're actors so it's fine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch_8ngel | 1,597 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 1 hour ago, drxandy said: https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/06/19/politics/mike-pence-black-lives-matter-all-lives-matter/index.html Asked repeatedly to say 'Black lives matter,' Mike Pence says 'all lives matter' We need a "vomit" "like-button" reply... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estil | 1,291 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 5 hours ago, Bearcat-Doug said: Tough to argue with Einstein. The ones doing evil right now are the rioters and the vandals who are going out of their way to hurt people and break/burn things and those who punch/hurt people just for wearing MAGA caps. Yet even here those get routinely glossed over. Your political opponents are NOT your enemies. Period. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estil | 1,291 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 Just now, arch_8ngel said: We need a "vomit" "like-button" reply... Why this big pressure job regarding saying BLM? It is our own free choice as American citizens what we believe and don't believe and what we support and what we oppose. There is no way I'm going to say those three magic words unqualified because there are way too many strings attached to it. All Lives DO Matter...and Free Speech Matters too. And I stand behind those. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat-Doug | 5,123 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 1 minute ago, Estil said: The ones doing evil right now are the rioters and the vandals who are going out of their way to hurt people and break/burn things and those who punch/hurt people just for wearing MAGA caps. Yet even here those get routinely glossed over. Your political opponents are NOT your enemies. Period. People just breaking and burning things are also in the wrong. There can be people to go too far both ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estil | 1,291 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 Just now, Bearcat-Doug said: People just breaking and burning things are also in the wrong. There can be people to go too far both ways. Half the people here couldn't care less I'm sorry to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estil | 1,291 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 7 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said: "Casual racism" is very definitely a thing,. And "dog whistles" are very definitely a real thing. Says who? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat-Doug | 5,123 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 Just now, Estil said: Half the people here couldn't care less I'm sorry to say. I must have missed the part where people were endorsing looting and rioting. Peaceful protests have a place. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat-Doug | 5,123 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 7 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said: We need a "vomit" "like-button" reply... Can I get one for real life? I don't understand why people can't take three words at face value without putting qualifiers on them. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estil | 1,291 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 Just now, Bearcat-Doug said: I must have missed the part where people were endorsing looting and rioting. Peaceful protests have a place. Not exactly endorsing but most definitely glossing over it and rationalizing it. I was even ridiculed for having this "fascination" with rioters/vandals and I tried to explain again and again I have no issue whatsoever with the regular law abiding responsible peaceful protesters who are I HOPE the vast vast majority. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estil | 1,291 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 (edited) 1 minute ago, Bearcat-Doug said: Can I get one for real life? I don't understand why people can't take three words at face value without putting qualifiers on them. Because of all the strings attached and expectations that come with it, as I've already explained many times. That's why. Edited June 21, 2020 by Estil 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat-Doug | 5,123 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 1 minute ago, Estil said: Not exactly endorsing but most definitely glossing over it and rationalizing it. I was even ridiculed for having this "fascination" with rioters/vandals and I tried to explain again and again I have no issue whatsoever with the regular law abiding responsible peaceful protesters who are I HOPE the vast vast majority. I'm just saying that I didn't see anyone say that looting and rioting was better than a peaceful protest. That's all. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fcgamer | 5,015 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 5 hours ago, Bearcat-Doug said: I could also wear a swastika and claim that it was originally meant as a symbol of prosperity, but I'm betting 99.99% of people wouldn't see it that way. The meaning of symbols evolve just like words, so it might be a good idea to keep up with the current interpretation. I see the original symbol quite frequently over here, and it often gets put onto jewelry, and other items. It was really hard to get used to it initially, but to me it showcases how differently some people can interpret essentially one symbol. Another example is that over here 666 is considered a lucky/prosperous number, often appearing in phone numbers, on licence plates, etc. Definitely doesn't make everyone here a Satanist or something though, highlighting why imo it's worse to apply such broad accusations or assumptions against others just over a symbol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat-Doug | 5,123 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Estil said: Because of all the strings attached and expectations that come with it, as I've already explained many times. That's why. Where are the strings? Saying black lives matter means exactly that. They aren't saying they mean more than anyone else's. They aren't being treated equally and they are asking to get fair treatment. How people twist it around to mean black lives are better is beyond me. Edited June 21, 2020 by Bearcat-Doug 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat-Doug | 5,123 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 4 minutes ago, fcgamer said: I see the original symbol quite frequently over here, and it often gets put onto jewelry, and other items. It was really hard to get used to it initially, but to me it showcases how differently some people can interpret essentially one symbol. Another example is that over here 666 is considered a lucky/prosperous number, often appearing in phone numbers, on licence plates, etc. Definitely doesn't make everyone here a Satanist or something though, highlighting why imo it's worse to apply such broad accusations or assumptions against others just over a symbol. I'm aware of the original meanings. That's not the case for the majority of people and if that many people find it offensive with good reason, maybe it's best not to use that symbol. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch_8ngel | 1,597 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Estil said: Why this big pressure job regarding saying BLM? It is our own free choice as American citizens what we believe and don't believe and what we support and what we oppose. There is no way I'm going to say those three magic words unqualified because there are way too many strings attached to it. All Lives DO Matter...and Free Speech Matters too. And I stand behind those. It isn't that he "didn't say BLM", it is that he chose to actively engaged in the dog-whistle of "all lives matter". He isn't dumb enough to think that "all lives matter" is a politically neutral thing to say, or that it isn't going to get lapped up by the right as him thumbing his nose at the issue. Edited June 21, 2020 by arch_8ngel 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fcgamer | 5,015 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 1 minute ago, Bearcat-Doug said: I'm aware of the original meanings. That's not the case for the majority of people and if that many people find it offensive with good reason, maybe it's best not to use that symbol. So if I'm offended by 666 in a country where most people aren't aware of its other meaning, they shouldn't use it, for my sake? Or if I'm offended by the swastika or anything that looks remotely similar to it? That would be absurd for me to even suggest, and I know the response from most here would be along the lines of "you chose to move there so it doesn't count" or "white people can't be offended" or something stupid like that. If we are going to apply generalisations , we can't start adding strings just to suit our narratives and ideologies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch_8ngel | 1,597 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 (edited) 28 minutes ago, Estil said: Says who? Says reality and the American-English lexicon that defines what the terms mean in common usage. Edited June 21, 2020 by arch_8ngel 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat-Doug | 5,123 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 Just now, fcgamer said: So if I'm offended by 666 in a country where most people aren't aware of its other meaning, they shouldn't use it, for my sake? Or if I'm offended by the swastika or anything that looks remotely similar to it? That would be absurd for me to even suggest, and I know the response from most here would be along the lines of "you chose to move there so it doesn't count" or "white people can't be offended" or something stupid like that. If we are going to apply generalisations , we can't start adding strings just to suit our narratives and ideologies. If it still has a primarily positive meaning in Taiwan then it's acceptable in that situation. Things do have to be taken into context, I won't argue that. It's just important to consider how it may make others feel in a given situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat-Doug | 5,123 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 12 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said: Says reality and the American-English lexicon that defines what the terms mean in common usage. Don't go quoting the dictionary. I think I already tried that and it confuses some people. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulpa | 3,715 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trumps-tulsa-rally-draws-low-turnout-amid-tense-political-backdrop-anti-racism-protests-and-the-coronavirus/ar-BB15LqRp?li=BBnb7Kz Trump's Tulsa rally draws low turnout amid tense political backdrop, anti-racism protests and the coronavirus "A large crowd of his supporters sporting 'Make America Great Again' hats, shirts, and signs, gathered inside the arena, many of whom were not wearings masks, but the campaign's crowd expectations were not met as many seats were empty. Some supporters near the podium appeared to be wearing face coverings. Republican lawmakers, many of whom were not wearing face coverings, were also in attendance." 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fcgamer | 5,015 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 14 minutes ago, Bearcat-Doug said: If it still has a primarily positive meaning in Taiwan then it's acceptable in that situation. Things do have to be taken into context, I won't argue that. It's just important to consider how it may make others feel in a given situation. I'd reckon actually it has this meaning in the vast majority of Asia. I'd truly love to see a situation play out where an Asian living in the States tries to defend his or her religious symbols against someone that isn't aware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estil | 1,291 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 1 minute ago, fcgamer said: I'd reckon actually it has this meaning in the vast majority of Asia. I'd truly love to see a situation play out where an Asian living in the States tries to defend his or her religious symbols against someone that isn't aware. Well yes I thought we were supposed to respect other cultures? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat-Doug | 5,123 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 Just now, fcgamer said: I'd reckon actually it has this meaning in the vast majority of Asia. I'd truly love to see a situation play out where an Asian living in the States tries to defend his or her religious symbols against someone that isn't aware. I know some Chinese Buddhists and they don't seem to have any issues. Fortunately, people can be tolerant and understanding when they want to be which does give me some hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fcgamer | 5,015 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 14 minutes ago, Bearcat-Doug said: I know some Chinese Buddhists and they don't seem to have any issues. Fortunately, people can be tolerant and understanding when they want to be which does give me some hope. Born and raised in the States though? I think it would be a totally different scenario trying to explain to someone that currently resides here and has little understanding of the holocaust, the potential misunderstanding of the symbol, even if they were doing some time abroad, compared to someone growing up or spending most of their time in the States, exposed to the other meaning. I think this sort of situation also can be applied to the flag. People that try to say it only has one meaning (either southern heritage, or racism) are both wrong, imo, and a little sensitivity shown both ways to respect the feelings of both parties would probably help a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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